Insert Disc1 error

[NewsArchive]

One of the installs I have is now asking to Insert Disc1 and there is no
disc1. Where is that coming from?
Thanks
Nev

[NewsArchive]

> One of the installs I have is now asking to Insert Disc1 and there is no
> disc1. Where is that coming from?

Nev,

Anytime you or your customer see that message it is a bad download.

Charles

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Charles Edmonds
www.ezchangelog.com - "Free ChangeLog software to manage your projects!"
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developers - enhanced for SetupBuilder users!"
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[NewsArchive]

OK. Thanks Charges.
Don't you ever sleep?
Nev

[NewsArchive]

Spelt that one wrong. Meant to be Charles! Sorry mate, first name is the
most important thing in anyone's life.
Nev

[NewsArchive]

> Spelt that one wrong. Meant to be Charles! Sorry mate, first name is the
> most important thing in anyone's life.

No worries Nev,

Your right - the first name is much more important than some things (like
sleep - which is highly overrated<g>)

Friedrich and I are in competition to see who can work the most years
without sleep.

According to our wives it is a dead heat.

As a result, we both hear a lot of:

"You look like Charles..."
"You look like Friedrich..."

:-)

Charles



--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Charles Edmonds
www.ezchangelog.com - "Free ChangeLog software to manage your projects!"
www.setupcast.com - "A revolutionary new publishing system for software
developers - enhanced for SetupBuilder users!"
www.pagesnip.com - "Print and Save the Web, just the way you want it!"
www.clarionproseries.com - "Serious imaging tools for Clarion Developers"
www.ezround.com - "Round Corner HTML tables with matching Banners, Buttons
and Forms!"
www.lansrad.com - "Intelligent Solutions for Universal Problems"
www.fotokiss.com - "World's Best Auction Photo Editor"
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[NewsArchive]

> According to our wives it is a dead heat.
>
> As a result, we both hear a lot of:
>
> "You look like Charles..."
> "You look like Friedrich..."

<ROFL> :)

Friedrich

[NewsArchive]

Nev,

> One of the installs I have is now asking to Insert Disc1 and there is no
> disc1. Where is that coming from?

It's coming from an incomplete download (or upload).

I think you had a similar problem some time ago -- but in that install you
had the integrity check enabled:

http://www.lindersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?p=25723#post25723

Friedrich

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder "point. click. ship"
Create Windows Vista ready installations in minutes

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

No, that was just the integrity check. That shows up in the unpacking. This
was the first time I had seen the Disc1 thingo. I normally upload and then
download and test, so it must be a bad download at the site.
Regards
Nev

[NewsArchive]

Hi Nev,

> No, that was just the integrity check. That shows up in the unpacking.
> This was the first time I had seen the Disc1 thingo. I normally upload and
> then download and test, so it must be a bad download at the site.

Yes, that's the same "bad" download/update scenario :) Without the
"integrity check" enabled, you would have seen the very same typical
"Insert Disk 1" message.

So I assume you have "integrity check" disabled in this (new) install?

Friedrich

[NewsArchive]

By the way, if the installer is code-signed, you can select the file in your
Explorer, select the file properties, then the "Digital Signature" tab.
Press the "Details" button and the signature status appears. If there was a
transmission problem, you'll see a "This digital signature is not valid"
error (see attached screenshot).

Friedrich

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder "point. click. ship"
Create Windows Vista ready installations in minutes

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

A file with a valid code-signature looks like this (see attached
screenshot).

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder "point. click. ship"
Create Windows Vista ready installations in minutes

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

> By the way, if the installer is code-signed, you can select the file in your
> Explorer, select the file properties, then the "Digital Signature" tab.
> Press the "Details" button and the signature status appears. If there was a
> transmission problem, you'll see a "This digital signature is not valid"
> error (see attached screenshot).

Friedrich,

Project Definition - General Information visualizer - Advanced Tab

Since we Code Sign our installers now, is the Enable Installer Integrity
Check as important to an install.

David

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From David Troxell Product Scope 7 - Encourager Software
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
Profile Exchanges - www.encouragersoftware.com/profile/
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

Absolutely, IMNSHO...
The failed digital signature won't prevent the OS from trying to run a
corrupt download, whereas the installer integrity check will.

In fact, I experienced this exact scenario a few months ago. I bought and
downloaded a third-party tool that did not have the integrity check enabled.
It started to install and got far enough to have cached its demo maintenance
plan info, then crashed. At that point, I looked at the downloaded
installer and saw the invalid digital signature.
Even after I redownloaded, it refused to install because it saw the invalid
maintenance plan.
I had to contact the author to ask how to pull the fangs of the broken
install so I could start over.

Jane

[NewsArchive]

> Absolutely, IMNSHO...
> The failed digital signature won't prevent the OS from trying to run a
> corrupt download, whereas the installer integrity check will.
>
> In fact, I experienced this exact scenario a few months ago. I bought and
> downloaded a third-party tool that did not have the integrity check enabled.

Jane,

Thanks for sharing this "real world" story - BTW, how did you know this
third party tool "DID NOT have the integrity check enabled" - you mention
the "invalid digital signature" - aren't these two separate methods?

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7 - Encourager Software
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
Profile Exchanges - www.encouragersoftware.com/profile/
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

Hi David,

> Thanks for sharing this "real world" story - BTW, how did you know this
> third party tool "DID NOT have the integrity check enabled" - you mention
> the "invalid digital signature" - aren't these two separate methods?

When the Integrity check is turned on, the install will show a window when
it starts up while it validates the integrity of the install file. This
happened to be one of my tools and Jane had a corrupt install causing weird
things to happen. Since then I have added the integrity check to all my
installs for next releases:)

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Creative, Inc.
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

> Hi David,
>
> On 2 Mar 2009 18:20:18 -0500, David Troxell - Encourager Software wrote:
>
>> Thanks for sharing this "real world" story - BTW, how did you know this
>> third party tool "DID NOT have the integrity check enabled" - you mention
>> the "invalid digital signature" - aren't these two separate methods?
>
> When the Integrity check is turned on, the install will show a window when
> it starts up while it validates the integrity of the install file. This
> happened to be one of my tools and Jane had a corrupt install causing weird
> things to happen. Since then I have added the integrity check to all my
> installs for next releases:)

Arnor,

Thanks for this expanded explanation -

I need to go back and retest with the latest SB builds - 1 or 2 SB 6.9
builds back, I was testing integrity check enabled with Windows 7 install -
it did not install properly - UNCHECKED Enable Installer Integrity Check -
recompiled - it installed properly to Windows 7.

(can't remember if I then tried troubleshooter compatibility after the
failed Windows 7 install or not)

I realize that Windows 7 is beta, and of course, my company won't
Officially support it - for now - but it doesn't hurt to keep track of
testing in all UAC Window operating systems - beta or not.

One observation about latest builds for both SB 6.9 and SB7. (This was with
Enable Installer Integrity Check - UNCHECKED)

This install is my Product Scope 7.6 release (available to registered
users, but not available for general public release for now)

I used the a copy of the SAME SB6 install file (located appropriately in SB
6.9 and SB 7 separate dev folders) and recompiled under SB 6.9 and SB 7.

Latest SB 6.9 build - 6.9.2516 - Installed properly to Windows 7, but Not
Windows Server 7 (however, one could use troubleshooter compatibility mode
and it would install properly).

Latest SB 7 build - 7.0.2441 - Installed properly to Windows 7, AND Windows
Server 7.

David

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From David Troxell - Product Scope 7 - Encourager Software
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Profile Exchanges - www.encouragersoftware.com/profile/
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[NewsArchive]

I always have that check turned on. I can't think of why it would even be
an option.

--
Russell B. Eggen
www.radfusion.com
Skype Clarion chat: http://tinyurl.com/2273lm

[NewsArchive]

Hi Russ,

> I always have that check turned on. I can't think of why it would even be
> an option.

I have to admit that I just plain missed it<g>

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Creative, Inc.
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Russ,

I think the intention may have been that if you're installing from media
(CD, etc.) the prospects of a corrupt installation are minimal... and for a
large installation, not counting fingers and toes might save a couple of
seconds.

But for any Internet-based installation, I think the integrity check is
essential.

Jane

[NewsArchive]

David,

I knew the integrity check wasn't turned on because IIRC I explicitly asked
Arnor after I had the problem. ;-) And I asked because I knew that if it
were enabled, a corrupt download would not have run and created the problem
I experienced.

Yes, they are two separate "methods". But both of them have the similarity
of requiring that the file not be altered (or corrupted).
The integrity check is enforced by SetupBuilder, and the install will refuse
to run if the file's CRC (or whatever Friedrich is using) doesn't check out.
The digital signature includes a hash of the file, created when the program
is signed. The client operating system can run its own hash and compare
that with the hash in the signature to verify that the file is unaltered
(which is why when you go into the Digital Signatures tab on the properties
sheet for a large file, it may take some seconds before you get the "digital
signature is OK" message.) A digital signature is primarily intended to
guarantee two things - who created the program and that it has not been
altered since it was signed.

Jane

[NewsArchive]

> David,
>
> I knew the integrity check wasn't turned on because IIRC I explicitly asked
> Arnor after I had the problem. ;-)

Jane,

Well, that makes sense! :-D

> And I asked because I knew that if it
> were enabled, a corrupt download would not have run and created the problem
> I experienced.

Actually, I recently ask Friedrich to explain the "two methods" - Enable
Installer Integrity Check and Digital Signatures - essentially is the first
still necessary - well, I guess he would probably answer -

"What Jane said!"

Thanks for the detailed explanation.

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7 - Encourager Software
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
Profile Exchanges - www.encouragersoftware.com/profile/
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

Hi David,

> Actually, I recently ask Friedrich to explain the "two methods" - Enable
> Installer Integrity Check and Digital Signatures - essentially is the first
> still necessary - well, I guess he would probably answer -

To _me_ those two methods are very different. The Integrity check is an
_internal check of the install to make sure it is ok. The Digital signature
is an _external check of the install to make sure it is ok. Similar to
using the Armadillo shell to protect an executable while using calls to the
shell from within the program to check for it's integrity, expiration date,
etc.

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Creative, Inc.
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

> Hi David,
>
> On 2 Mar 2009 22:33:36 -0500, David Troxell - Encourager Software wrote:
>
>> Actually, I recently ask Friedrich to explain the "two methods" - Enable
>> Installer Integrity Check and Digital Signatures - essentially is the first
>> still necessary - well, I guess he would probably answer -
>
> To _me_ those two methods are very different. The Integrity check is an
> _internal check of the install to make sure it is ok. The Digital signature
> is an _external check of the install to make sure it is ok. Similar to
> using the Armadillo shell to protect an executable while using calls to the
> shell from within the program to check for it's integrity, expiration date,
> etc.

Arnor,

Yes, I can now more CLEARLY see (between Jane's explanation and yours), in
today's PC world, we MUST use a Digital Signature -

BUT SetupBuilder's Installer Integrity Check is another great tool in our
install programs to insure the highest level of installer integrity while
delivering over web methods.

BTW, I did some VERY recent testing with Product Scope 7.6 installer:

Enable Installer Integrity Check - Checked!

Used Latest SB 7 build - 7.0.2441 to compile.

- Installed successfully to XP Home, Vista Ultimate 32, Windows 7 (64), AND
Windows Server 7 (64).

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7 - Encourager Software
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http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
Profile Exchanges - www.encouragersoftware.com/profile/
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich
The Digital sig is valid doing what you suggest.
Thanks
Nev

[NewsArchive]

Thanks Friedrich,
I'll check that today but thought it was turned on.
Ne v

[NewsArchive]

Hi David,

> Project Definition - General Information visualizer - Advanced Tab
>
> Since we Code Sign our installers now, is the Enable Installer
> Integrity Check as important to an install.

Yes, exactly what Jane said. It's important for single-file installation
executables that are distributed over the Internet. Especially for large
setup.exe files or if you know that some of your customers do not have a
stable Internet connection. Or if you make a new software version available
and chances are that the high-traffic will bring your server to it's knees.
Then it's good to have an automatic instance available to detect such
incomplete (or corrupted) downloads. But even if you do not use the
"Installer Integrity Check" feature, SetupBuilder will *always* detect a
corrupted setup.exe.

If you distribute the installer .EXE packaged in a .ZIP, then you don't need
the "Installer Integrity Check". I would also not do it for installations
distributed via CD/DVD or memory sticks.

Friedrich

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder "point. click. ship"
Create Windows Vista ready installations in minutes

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

> Hi David,
>
>> Project Definition - General Information visualizer - Advanced Tab
>>
>> Since we Code Sign our installers now, is the Enable Installer
>> Integrity Check as important to an install.
>
> Yes, exactly what Jane said. It's important for single-file installation
> executables that are distributed over the Internet.

Friedrich,

OK, thanks to you, Jane (and Arnor) for the expanded explanation.

I was a bit hesitant to include it recently because -

"1 or 2 SB 6.9 builds back, I was testing integrity check enabled with
Windows 7 install - it did not install properly - This install did work
properly with Vista Ultimate 32 and XP Home -

UNCHECKED Enable Installer Integrity Check - recompiled - it installed
properly to Windows 7."

However,

I did some VERY recent testing with Product Scope 7.6 installer:

Enable Installer Integrity Check - Checked!

Used Latest SB 7 build - 7.0.2441 to compile.

- Installed successfully to XP Home, Vista Ultimate 32, Windows 7 (64), AND
Windows Server 7 (64).

Good to go! :-D

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7 - Encourager Software
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
Profile Exchanges - www.encouragersoftware.com/profile/
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

Hi David,

> I did some VERY recent testing with Product Scope 7.6 installer:
>
> Enable Installer Integrity Check - Checked!
>
> Used Latest SB 7 build - 7.0.2441 to compile.
>
> - Installed successfully to XP Home, Vista Ultimate 32, Windows 7 (64),
> AND
> Windows Server 7 (64).
>
> Good to go! :-D

Cool! Thanks for the update :-)

Friedrich

[NewsArchive]

That would make sense, but a self-check is always safe. I would prefer a
hot babe doing my checks, oh wait! ;-)

--
Russell B. Eggen
www.radfusion.com
Skype Clarion chat: http://tinyurl.com/2273lm

[NewsArchive]

Well... depending on your check book's quality, Russ, you might just find
some success in that area <G>

Jane Fleming

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich,

> If you distribute the installer .EXE packaged in a .ZIP, then you don't need
> the "Installer Integrity Check". I would also not do it for installations
> distributed via CD/DVD or memory sticks.

There is nothing to prevent a possibly corrupt install being successfully
burned to a cd/dvd, in which case the integrity check would find it. Or am
I missing something?

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Creative, Inc.
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Hi Arnór,

>> If you distribute the installer .EXE packaged in a .ZIP, then you
>> don't need the "Installer Integrity Check". I would also not do
>> it for installations distributed via CD/DVD or memory sticks.
>
> There is nothing to prevent a possibly corrupt install being successfully
> burned to a cd/dvd, in which case the integrity check would find it. Or
> am I missing something?

IMO, a corrupt installation image on a CD/DVD is very unlikely -- but yes,
possible.

For Setup Script Consulting projects, we never enable the "Installer
Integrity Check" feature when doing CD/DVD releases.

Friedrich

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder "point. click. ship"
Create Windows Vista ready installations in minutes

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich,

> For Setup Script Consulting projects, we never enable the "Installer
> Integrity Check" feature when doing CD/DVD releases.

Can it have any bad effects if it is enabled on CD/DVD?

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Creative, Inc.
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich,

> Can it have any bad effects if it is enabled on CD/DVD?

What I'm driving at is that if someone takes one of our installs that use
the integrity check and burns it to a CD for safekeeping and they run it
from the CD rather than copy it to the HD, are they going to have any
problems with it because of the integrity check?

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Creative, Inc.
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Hi Arnór,

>> Can it have any bad effects if it is enabled on CD/DVD?
>
> What I'm driving at is that if someone takes one of our installs that
> use the integrity check and burns it to a CD for safekeeping and they
> run it from the CD rather than copy it to the HD, are they going to
> have any problems with it because of the integrity check?

No, there are no bad effects in this case.

But here are some information on "large" installations (200+ MB). The
following will happen on modern Windows operating systems (especially on
Vista, it might take some time to complete).

1. Depending on individual security configurations, a virus scanner
"processes" the complete setup.exe (to check for viruses, etc.).

2. Windows scans through the complete setup.exe to verify the code-sign
signature.

3. Windows scans again through the complete file to detect manifest
information.

The above steps are executed BEFORE the installer is even started.

4. After that, Windows runs the setup executable. If the "integrity check"
in SetupBuilder is enabled, the complete file is again processed to generate
the fingerprint verification signature.

IMO, it's not worth the extra "integrity check" processing time for
installations that were designed for CD/DVD distribution.

In SetupBuilder 7.x, there will be a new option to minimize the overhead
caused by the pre-installer steps 1., 2. and 3. SB7.x lets you compile a
setup.exe and a separate setup.bin for large installations (similar to the
current multiple-volume feature). Windows will only process the very small
setup.exe to do the code-signature and manifest scan -- this will result in
a huge performance boost for all the above pre-installer steps.

Friedrich

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder "point. click. ship"
Create Windows Vista ready installations in minutes

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich,

> following will happen on modern Windows operating systems (especially on
> Vista, it might take some time to complete).
>
> 2. Windows scans through the complete setup.exe to verify the code-sign
> signature.

On Vista, even on relatively fast computers hooked up to a Gigabit network
with Cat-6 cables this can indeed take a while! I have a 60MB install for a
client and I've long since learned to COPY it to the local machine (takes 2
seconds to do) rather than wait the two minutes or whatever that it takes
for windows to scan it over the network! Also, I've noticed that for a good
chunk of that time absolutely noting seems to be happening, indicating that
you never activated the shortcut.

> IMO, it's not worth the extra "integrity check" processing time for
> installations that were designed for CD/DVD distribution.

Agreed, I would not use it in that situation, was just curious if anything
bad would happen;)

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Creative, Inc.
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php