Conversion issue

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich,

I posted this a few weeks ago but didn't get a reply.

There is a problem with the conversion of SB6 projects in SB7. SB7 does NOT
automatically save the new, converted file with a ".SB7" extension so now
you end up with at SB7 file with a SB6 extension.

This is a major issue in BA which uses ShellExecuteEx to run SB and with the
WRONG file extension it will attempt to compile it in SB6.

As far as I can tell, SB7 also does NOT warn when overwriting the SB6 file
with the SB7 format, which I think it definitely should do.

IMO, SB7 should ONLY save files with ".SB7" extension to prevent problems.

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Alta LLC
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com - www.altawebworks.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Hmmm I reported this to Friedrich last week. When saving a SB6 file in SB7
the dialog box shows Save as type of SB7 but continues to save with a SB6
extension (despite being SB7).

Maybe Friedrich will take a look at this again as the response last time
seemed to imply this was not a problem.

FWIW

John Fligg

[NewsArchive]

Arnor,

Are you on the latest build? I haven't tested this issue, but in
Friedrich's 2712 Maintenance Release post on 9/7 he wrote:

FIX : [SB#908112] IDE: Open a SB6 and "save-as" SB7 ended up as:
Myfile.sb6.sb7.

So he may think he's fixed it.

Jane

[NewsArchive]

Jane

I am on the latest build and my question to Friedrich and the response
indeed confirmed he had fixed that problem.

My issue is that when saving a SB6 converted file the file type to Save As
indicates SB7 but it still saves it as a SB6 file.

Friedrichs response was ...

"You have to remove the .sb6 extension to save it as .sb7. Otherwise, it
will be saved as .sb6"

My point was that if SB7 itself KNEW it was a SB7 file it was supposed to be
saving, why do we have to remove the SB6 extension ourselves? After all SB7
is saying "Save as SB7 type".

Possibly a bit pedantic but it did cause me problems inadvertently with
build Automator by Arnor.

FWIW

John Fligg

[NewsArchive]

> Arnor,
>
> Are you on the latest build? I haven't tested this issue, but in
> Friedrich's 2712 Maintenance Release post on 9/7 he wrote:
>
> FIX : [SB#908112] IDE: Open a SB6 and "save-as" SB7 ended up as:
> Myfile.sb6.sb7.
>
> So he may think he's fixed it.

Jane,

I think there actually were two separate issues - yes, the "Open a SB6 and
"save-as" SB7 ended up as: Myfile.sb6.sb7" is fixed in my tests.

BUT, the point Arnor is making - AND is STILL not resolved - open a SB6 -
the IDE requires a conversion - it CAN NO LONGER be used in SetupBuilder 6
- even with SB6 extension -

so AS you open an SB6 in the latest SetupBuilder 7 IDE, AND it converts the
file, AT the same time, the extension should be renamed to SB7!

I am manually changing the extension to sb7 during the conversion, but why
should we have to take this extra step?

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7.9 - Encourager Software
Product Scope 7 Viewer - NO Registration Fee! Free to Use!
http://www.encouragersoftware.com/
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

I understand your point, David, and John's. (And Arnor's).

Which is why I phrased it as I did - that Friedrich may think he dealt with
your issue by fixing the naming bug.

The last I heard from him about 10 days ago was that he is still overwhelmed
dealing with his dying aunt.
In his words: "IT'S STILL A NIGHTMARE... :-("

I also haven't heard back from him on a couple of things. I'd counsel
patience.

Jane

[NewsArchive]

> I understand your point, David, and John's. (And Arnor's).
>
> Which is why I phrased it as I did - that Friedrich may think he dealt with
> your issue by fixing the naming bug.
>
> The last I heard from him about 10 days ago was that he is still overwhelmed
> dealing with his dying aunt.
> In his words: "IT'S STILL A NIGHTMARE... :-("
>
> I also haven't heard back from him on a couple of things. I'd counsel
> patience.

Jane,

Of course, first and foremost, our prayers are with Friedrich and family
during this time of difficulty.

AND, no one needs an immediate answer to this particular request - we have
an easy enough work around for now - just a request to be considered to
handle this differently for a future maintenance update.

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7.9 - Encourager Software
Product Scope 7 Viewer - NO Registration Fee! Free to Use!
http://www.encouragersoftware.com/
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

> BUT, the point Arnor is making - AND is STILL not resolved - open a SB6 -
> the IDE requires a conversion - it CAN NO LONGER be used in SetupBuilder 6
> - even with SB6 extension -

SB6 projects "converted" to SB7 (with or without .sb6 extension) can be used
in SetupBuilder 6.

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder is Windows installation -- "point. click. ship"

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

I have changed the "Save as..." function in the latest internal source
codes. It always saves projects with the .SB7 extension now.

This is a permanent change in SetupBuilder. All previous SetupBuilder
versions (SB1 - SB6) did not change the extension.

Thanks for your suggestions.

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder is Windows installation -- "point. click. ship"

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

Hi Arnór,

IMO, it's not a "bug". See attached screenshot from the Clarion 6 IDE. The
file http.CLW is loaded in the Clarion IDE. I select save as .TXT and does
it save as http.TXT or http.CLW? It saves as .CLW. You have to remove the
..sb6 extension to save it as .sb7. Otherwise, it will be saved as .sb6.

But I agree. Perhaps I should add a global setting that allows to save as
..SB7 only.

Friedrich

[NewsArchive]

>> BUT, the point Arnor is making - AND is STILL not resolved - open a SB6 -
>> the IDE requires a conversion - it CAN NO LONGER be used in SetupBuilder 6
>> - even with SB6 extension -
>
> SB6 projects "converted" to SB7 (with or without .sb6 extension) can be used
> in SetupBuilder 6.

Friedrich,

OK, My "bad" for not checking on actual SetupBuilder 6 use - but my
confusion about this issue was the "Once a project has been converted, it
can no longer be edited in previous versions of SetupBuilder" warning.

For a test, I opened an *.sb6 project that had never been opened in
Setupbuilder 7 - I was given the conversion warning, and I saved the
project at least once in Setupbuilder 7

Product: Developer Edition - Installation Authoring and Configuration
Management System
Version: 7.0.2712

THEN, I did successfully loaded the same .sb6 project in SetupBuilder 6

Product: Developer Edition - Installation Authoring and Configuration
Management System
Version: 6.9.2581

The warning specifically states - it can no longer be edited in previous
versions - yet it loaded in 6.9.2581 - so, as long as one keeps an sb6
extension on the project, it CAN be loaded in SetupBuilder 6, and this
seems to be an exception rule, yes?

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7.9 - Encourager Software
Product Scope 7 Viewer - NO Registration Fee! Free to Use!
http://www.encouragersoftware.com/
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

>>> BUT, the point Arnor is making - AND is STILL not resolved - open a SB6 -
>>> the IDE requires a conversion - it CAN NO LONGER be used in SetupBuilder 6
>>> - even with SB6 extension -
>>
>> SB6 projects "converted" to SB7 (with or without .sb6 extension) can be used
>> in SetupBuilder 6.
>
> Friedrich,
>
> OK, My "bad" for not checking on actual SetupBuilder 6 use - but my
> confusion about this issue was the "Once a project has been converted, it
> can no longer be edited in previous versions of SetupBuilder" warning.
>
> For a test, I opened an *.sb6 project that had never been opened in
> Setupbuilder 7 - I was given the conversion warning, and I saved the
> project at least once in Setupbuilder 7
>
> Product: Developer Edition - Installation Authoring and Configuration
> Management System
> Version: 7.0.2712
>
> THEN, I did successfully loaded the same .sb6 project in SetupBuilder 6
>
> Product: Developer Edition - Installation Authoring and Configuration
> Management System
> Version: 6.9.2581
>
> The warning specifically states - it can no longer be edited in previous
> versions - yet it loaded in 6.9.2581 - so, as long as one keeps an sb6
> extension on the project, it CAN be loaded in SetupBuilder 6, and this
> seems to be an exception rule, yes?

Friedrich,

OK, I misread the statement - "(with or without .sb6 extension)"

But I think the point is this: whether you continue with sb6 and sb7
extensions, or just use sb extension -

when we load an sb project - why should we have to dig through a
Setupbuilder Project .sb7, .sb6, or .sb5 dialog choice -

just have the open choice recognize it's a SetupBuilder Project OR Include
script (2 choices - default SetupBuilder Project)

AND, if it needs to convert a previous project, have it default to .sb7
extension (if you continue to use that naming scheme), or just rename the
extension to sb if that is the new extension.

JAT,
David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7.9 - Encourager Software
Product Scope 7 Viewer - NO Registration Fee! Free to Use!
http://www.encouragersoftware.com/
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

David,

> AND, if it needs to convert a previous project, have it default to .sb7
> extension (if you continue to use that naming scheme), or just rename
> the extension to sb if that is the new extension.

Even a project with .sb7 extension can be loaded and compiled (as long as no
exclusive SB7 features are used) in SB6. SetupBuilder gives the "conversion
warning" to try to stop developers using converted projects in a previous
version. One minor change in the project (e.g. adding a single line that
displays a custom dialog) can make the project "non-compilable" in SB6. And
it's well possible that a future conversion process makes the project
incompatible with previous versions because of changes in the underlying
SetupScript structure.

BTW, we have all internal SB6 test projects (700+) converted to SB7 and
still have the .sb6 extension. We are using a batch compiler to
automatically compile all the test scripts. In this batch script, we only
have to change the compiler application from sbuilder.exe (SB6) to sb7.exe
(SB7) and we can use the new SetupBuilder version to compile the projects.
If the conversion process would automatically rename .sb6 to .sb7 then we
had to change the extensions for all the 700+ .sb6 items in the batch
script.

But in the next maintenance build, developers can use "Save as..." to save
converted projects with the .sb7 extension (it automatically renames *.sb6
to *.sb7).

Friedrich

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder is Windows installation -- "point. click. ship"

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

> David,
>
>> AND, if it needs to convert a previous project, have it default to .sb7
>> extension (if you continue to use that naming scheme), or just rename
>> the extension to sb if that is the new extension.
>
> Even a project with .sb7 extension can be loaded and compiled (as long as no
> exclusive SB7 features are used) in SB6. SetupBuilder gives the "conversion
> warning" to try to stop developers using converted projects in a previous
> version. One minor change in the project (e.g. adding a single line that
> displays a custom dialog) can make the project "non-compilable" in SB6. And
> it's well possible that a future conversion process makes the project
> incompatible with previous versions because of changes in the underlying
> SetupScript structure.
>
> BTW, we have all internal SB6 test projects (700+) converted to SB7 and
> still have the .sb6 extension. We are using a batch compiler to
> automatically compile all the test scripts. In this batch script, we only
> have to change the compiler application from sbuilder.exe (SB6) to sb7.exe
> (SB7) and we can use the new SetupBuilder version to compile the projects.
> If the conversion process would automatically rename .sb6 to .sb7 then we
> had to change the extensions for all the 700+ .sb6 items in the batch
> script.

Friedrich,

OK, I can appreciate this special 700+ test projects internal method you
are using, but I would say, this is more of a customer based preference,
and I would guess, it would be WIDELY preferred. Some of your key users and
testers are already asking for something very similar to my request.

We use SetupBuilder 7 because it will handle everything SetupBuilder 6
offered and MORE!

AND, as Arnor said:

>
> IMO, once a _conversion_ is done to a tool that uses a _different_
> extension, the extension should default to the new one. It is confusing to
> have SB7 projects with SB6 OR SB7 extensions.

So, as older projects are opened in SB7, it only seems logical, they are
converted and the extension is sb7.

> But in the next maintenance build, developers can use "Save as..." to save
> converted projects with the .sb7 extension (it automatically renames *.sb6
> to *.sb7).

So does mean - we have to take this EXTRA step - we can't just open an sb6
project, convert it - but we need to do a Save as to get the sb7 extension
added.

Well, I am already using a Save as method now, just so I can get the sb7
extension added by adding it manually because of the Open dialog defaulting
to sb7 extension.

OK, here is MY vote for a Preferred way of handling projects in SB7.

Open up a previous sb6 project, it gets converted and the SB7 or SB (if and
when you use that) extension is added.

Open File Dialog - No confusing sb7, or sb6 or sb5 choices - just
SetupBuilder projects OR Include script choices (2 choices only).

Thanks for listening! :-D

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7.9 - Encourager Software
Product Scope 7 Viewer - NO Registration Fee! Free to Use!
http://www.encouragersoftware.com/
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich,

> But I agree. Perhaps I should add a global setting that allows to save as
> ..SB7 only.

IMO, once a _conversion_ is done to a tool that uses a _different_
extension, the extension should default to the new one. It is confusing to
have SB7 projects with SB6 OR SB7 extensions.

Can the SB6 compiler handle everything that the SB7 compiler can? If not,
then my BA users will run into a problem sooner or later when they compile a
SB7 project with a SB6 extension which will trigger SB6 to run, not SB7.

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Alta LLC
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com - www.altawebworks.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Seems to me another question would be whether the SB7 compiler can handle
everything the SB6 compiler can.
If so, one could change the Windows file-association of xxxx.SB6 to point at
SB7.

For that matter, in that the conversion from SB6 to SB7 is seamless (albeit
one-way), now that SB7 has gone gold why bother keeping both installations
on the same machine?

Jane

[NewsArchive]

Jane,

> Seems to me another question would be whether the SB7 compiler can handle
> everything the SB6 compiler can.
> If so, one could change the Windows file-association of xxxx.SB6 to point
> at SB7.
>
> For that matter, in that the conversion from SB6 to SB7 is seamless
> (albeit one-way), now that SB7 has gone gold why bother keeping both
> installations on the same machine?

Very good point. Both SB6 and SB7 can coexist on the same machine, but SB7
can handle everything the SB6 compiler can.

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder is Windows installation -- "point. click. ship"

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

Hi Jane,

> For that matter, in that the conversion from SB6 to SB7 is seamless (albeit
> one-way), now that SB7 has gone gold why bother keeping both installations
> on the same machine?

Client projects.

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Alta LLC
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com - www.altawebworks.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Hi Arnór,

> IMO, once a _conversion_ is done to a tool that uses a _different_
> extension, the extension should default to the new one. It is confusing
> to have SB7 projects with SB6 OR SB7 extensions.
>
> Can the SB6 compiler handle everything that the SB7 compiler can? If not,
> then my BA users will run into a problem sooner or later when they compile
> a SB7 project with a SB6 extension which will trigger SB6 to run, not SB7.

The "conversion" process from SB6 to SB7 is nothing more than adding new SB7
properties to a SB6 created project. It does not touch the script. After
that conversion process, you can still compile the project in both SB6 or
SB7.

Even if you modify the project in SB7 (and you do not use new features that
are exclusive to SB7 -- for example: custom dialogs), you can still compile
that project in SB6.

I have changed the "Save as..." function in the latest internal source
codes. It always saves projects with the .SB7 extension now.

BTW, this thread was very useful. Some weeks ago, several developers asked
me to make the project extension .sb instead of .sbX in one of the next
builds and I agreed. This thread shows me that such a change would break
the automated process of creating new versions of software (e.g. powered by
Build Automator).

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder is Windows installation -- "point. click. ship"

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

Hi Friedrich,

> BTW, this thread was very useful. Some weeks ago, several developers asked
> me to make the project extension .sb instead of .sbX in one of the next
> builds and I agreed. This thread shows me that such a change would break
> the automated process of creating new versions of software (e.g. powered by
> Build Automator).

What I could do is allow people to pick the version of SB that they want to
compile a project with and just _suggest_ the version to use based on the
extension. However I'm not sure how older builds of SB, particularly SB5
would behave if you tried to get it to compile SB7 project;)

Best regards,

--
Arnór Baldvinsson - Icetips Alta LLC
Port Angeles, Washington
www.icetips.com - www.buildautomator.com - www.altawebworks.com

Icetips product subscriptions at http://www.icetips.com/subscribe.php

[NewsArchive]

Hi David,

> Open File Dialog - No confusing sb7, or sb6 or sb5 choices - just
> SetupBuilder projects OR Include script choices (2 choices only).

See attached screenshots. This is how it is in the latest internal build.

1. Open... - two choices only (*.sb7,*.sb6,*.sb5 and *.sbi)

2. Save As... - it automatically "renames" *.sb6 to *.sb7

Thank you for your suggestion!

Friedrich

--
Friedrich Linder
Lindersoft
www.lindersoft.com
+1.954.252.3910

SetupBuilder is Windows installation -- "point. click. ship"

-- Official Comodo Code Signing and SSL Certificate Partner

[NewsArchive]

> Hi David,
>
>> Open File Dialog - No confusing sb7, or sb6 or sb5 choices - just
>> SetupBuilder projects OR Include script choices (2 choices only).
>
> See attached screenshots. This is how it is in the latest internal build.
>
> 1. Open... - two choices only (*.sb7,*.sb6,*.sb5 and *.sbi)
>
> 2. Save As... - it automatically "renames" *.sb6 to *.sb7
>
> Thank you for your suggestion!

Friedrich,

THANK you!

David

--
From David Troxell - Product Scope 7.9 - Encourager Software
Product Scope 7 Viewer - NO Registration Fee! Free to Use!
http://www.encouragersoftware.com/
Clarion Third Party Profile Exchange Online
http://encouragersoftware.com/profile/clarlinks.html
http://www.profileexchanges.com/blog/