Comments on SetupBuilder 5

[NewsArchive]

Please Note! Cross Posted to softvelocity.clarion.addons.setupbuilder,
softvelocity.clarion.third_party and comp.lang.clarion

Hi All,

I am the proud Australian distributor of SB5. I am about to commence a
marketing campaign however my problem is that whilst I am very
experienced with SB5 I don't have a lot of experience with the other
competitive products

Could I ask for some feedback as to Advantages/Disadvantages,
weaknesses, strengths, general comments etc. Particularly those who
have purposely migrated from one of the others to SB5.

You can either post here or if you prefer please email me at
gspillaneATdatadownunderDOTcomDOTau.

Best Regards,
Geoff Spillane
Data Down Under

[NewsArchive]

Geoff,

I've tried once SB4, and it seemed to me like just another installation package. Sure, it DOES the
job, with the added bennefit of being "integrated" with Clarion.

However, Clarion integration is not THE feature.

InstallShield has long been the standard, but in my opinion, their product has grown way out of
scope. I mean: an installation that is 30MB+!! Geeezzz, it's almost another operating system inside
the operating system. Nahhh. Too complex.

SB is ok with its initial size. I dunno how is the current 5 version, and I'll tell you what keeps
me from testing it:

Satisfaction. Yeah, I could be satisfied if I were an SB user for some time now, but it happens that
way back there, I heard about Inno Setup. I'm pretty sure you heard of that too.

What makes me wonder is: the thing is small, fast, flexible, produces 100% compatible installations,
allows for automating ODBC, registry, OCX, DLL and the likes, and it is FREE! Hard to beat.

What I would like to see in an installation product's web site was a direct comparison matrix.

What is important to one, may no be to another. There's market for everyone. Just exploit what I
mentioned about IS mamoth size... Too complex leads to headaches...

Sometimes, less is more.

Hope you can find some value in my comments.

Gustavo

[NewsArchive]

Hi Gustavo,

Thank you very much for your feedback.
Yes I have used Inno Setup and the price is hard to beat <g>.
I will say that SB5 is a huge leap beyond SB4 and now the comparison
between SB5 and Inno Setup is like chalk and cheese.
I do like your idea of a direct comparison matrix and I will try to
put something together.

Best Regards,
Geoff Spillane
Data Down Under

[NewsArchive]

Hi Geoff

I would be particularly interested if you throw Install Shield into the mix.
We are very much in the market - leaning of course very much to Friedrich.

Cheers

Andre

[NewsArchive]

Hi Andre,

Yes InstallShield will definitely be in the comparison. I think you'll
be surprized just mauch further ahead SB5 is.

Best Regards,
Geoff Spillane
Data Down Under

[NewsArchive]

Setup Builder 5 is better than InstallShield - no brainer.

One thing about SetupBuilder 5 is that you can create an unlimited number of
installation screen dialogs, and control which are displayed or hidden,
during runtime, for any reason what-so-ever. That right there makes it
better than InstallShield.

I like the ability to select an entire directory for file contents and then
also exclude other's from that directory.

Example: All TPS files but not the SCN files. - Talk about how annoying it
is to doubleclick on it, create a SCN file, and then that ends up
distributed in your install app - but not with SetupBulider 5.

From what I've read, Inno Setup doesn't offer patching.

The scripting engine in SetupBuilder5 is feature rich, VERY! I believe
there are more programmable options than InstallShield. I would get the
count of scripting functions in both when creating the matrix.

-Robert

[NewsArchive]

Hi Robert,

I've seen all your posts on the SB5 group and note just how much of a
"power user" you are. It is also quite obvious that you have nothing
but praise for SB5 but it is good to see some of the reasons why you
prefer it to InstallShield.

I agree wholeheartedly on your comment regarding the number of
functions in SB5 and most certainly will be part of the comparison
matrix.

Thanks again for your comments.

Best Regards,
Geoff Spillane
Data Down Under

[NewsArchive]

I have always used installshield express. It has always did an ok job for
me. However, installshield was bought by another company. This company
cannot find their butt with both hands in my opinion. Support is absolutely
lousy. The upgrades only have new features that cost you money. I think that
installshield express has grown way overly complicated. In addition it
crashes a lot.

However, $400 is just too much for an installer in my opinion. I guess I
will keep using the version I have of installshield express or switch to
Inno

Tim

[NewsArchive]

Hi Tim,

Thanks very much for taking time to respond.

>I have always used installshield express. It has always did an ok job for
>me. However, installshield was bought by another company. This company
>cannot find their butt with both hands in my opinion. Support is absolutely
>lousy. The upgrades only have new features that cost you money. I think that
>installshield express has grown way overly complicated. In addition it
>crashes a lot.

Your observations of InstallShield Express have been echoed by many
other users of same.

>However, $400 is just too much for an installer in my opinion. I guess I
>will keep using the version I have of installshield express or switch to
>Inno

Regarding cost I would like to offer the following points:

Here you are comparing InstallShield's base product (which costs $449)
with SetupBuilder's premier product which costs $399. They are like
chalk and cheese in terms of features and performance. SB5
Professional is only $249. If you missed out on Macrovision's "Special
Price" for the current upgrade to InstallShield 11 Express of $99 you
would have to pay $199 just for the upgrade. If you want to compare
prices of SB5 Developer with say InstallShield 11 Professional
version we're talking $1,399. Furthermore SB5 includes a
free one year maintenance and support plan (all for $399) whereas
InstallShield 11 + a Developer Silver Maintenance License (includes
Subscription and Support) costs $2,200.

Regarding SB5 Developer just being an Installer I would like to raise
the following points:

For only $399 developers get a complete Installation Authoring and
Configuration Management environment. It's not a simple "installer".
SB5 supports .NET, Win64, web installs (full and partial), full and
partial web updates (aka live updates), high-performance binary
patching, security features (e.g. UpdatePROTECT),
dynamic/static/auto-update scanning, and much more.
SB5 works on Windows 95/98/Me, Windows NT/2000/XP, Windows 2003
Server, Windows x64, Windows Vista 32- and 64-bit.
Built-in support for Microsoft Internet Information Services and SQL
will be available soon.
Some of the new SB5 customers include: Microsoft, Hewlett Packard,
Dell, Boeing, American Express, UPS, Federal Express (to mention a
few).
The SB5 product opens new revenue channels (e.g. subscription based
services). And with Web Update you can offer new ways to make sure
your users have the most up-to-date versions of programs on their
systems.

I cannot argue that Inno Setup offers a good basic installer for free
and if your installation requirements do not extend beyond its
capabilities then it would have to be an obvious choice. If however
you find that it's not able to do everything you would like then
perhaps have a look at SB5 Pro. Remember Friedrich offers free trials
of both products and they are fully functional and have an unlimited
evaluation period.

Best Regards,
Geoff Spillane
Data Down Under

[NewsArchive]

Wait, there's more

When you buy InstallShield or Express or any product on the market today,
you get THAT product. They take your money, you download it, you get maybe
2 - 3 patches a year to fix their bug issues, and then you shell out another
$400 so they become a bigger corporation ready to be bought out by the next.
:-)

With SetupBuilder, it's like monthly, there's another download with more
features and more enhancements. It's like Christmas 12 months of the year.
If you look at the release dates progress of Inno, (or any product on the
market today), there is no product that has as many enhancements and options
that keep getting added to the product, on such a regular basis. In
addition, there is no better support for ANY installer product on the market
today than SetupBuilder.

If anyone uses anything other than SetupBuilder, it may be simply they do
not realize the value in SetupBuilder.

-Robert

[NewsArchive]

True,

But just remember that Inno was created for its writter was revolted with the practices of installation programs at the time, and didn't want to bow, so he wrote his own installation program, and decided to make it free, so other revolted people (DOH, am I one of these?) could at least have a choice.

It happens that for me, currently, it fulfills my needs, but when the day comes that I'll need to have the nice features of SB, certainly I'll not join the IS bandwagon. I'm not THAT stupid!

Gustavo

[NewsArchive]

Geoff's work on selling is so admirable, that I'm almost droping Inno and switching to SB5! I'm serios here...

I better stop following this thread fast.

Word, I've rarely seen a rep so engaged into making the minds of prospects, like this.

Good work!

Gustavo

[NewsArchive]

Forgot to mention: with absolute GOOD POINTS!

Gustavo

[NewsArchive]

Hi Gustavo,

Thanks for the kind words. I find it easy to sell something I
genuinely believe in.

I guess I am a little over-excited though <g>.

Best Regards,
Geoff Spillane
Data Down Under

[NewsArchive]

Not that much... you should see me in action at local expositions, in Clarion's booth (Clarion
Software Brasil). I miss that time.

Passionate professionals make a big difference. Keep up.

Regards